Centurions

Apr. 21st, 2013 11:00 am
bunn: (upside down)
[personal profile] bunn
The title of 'centurion' in the second-century AD Roman army seems to cover a pretty broad range of jobs - Wikipedia seems to think from about the equivalent of a modern British army lieutenant, up to about the equivalent of a major.

I have a character who has a background among the provincial aristocracy (not quite equestrian, but a rich family),  has served as an Auxiliary centurion for a while, and is now doing a pretty responsible/important job, reporting direct to the provincial governor.   I think he is still called a Centurion (even though he's presumably getting paid quite a lot) because he's not quite at equestrian level, and he's a career soldier who has been promoted.

When I am writing about him, I feel I need a way to refer to him that somehow communicates:  'This is a Very Important Centurion' to make it clear that he is In Charge, and other centurions are reporting to him. Any suggestions?

Date: 2013-04-21 12:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firin.livejournal.com
Is the position of Primus Pilus not appropriate?

Date: 2013-04-21 01:10 pm (UTC)
ext_189645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] bunn.livejournal.com
I wondered about that, but I get the impression that Primus Pilus is mostly about running a Legion under the Legate? IE, a key part of the main Legion admin/hierarchy?

Whereas this guy is an auxiliary centurion rather than a legionary (so little known about auxiliaries, hurray!) and has been sent to Sort Out The Silver Trade in Dumnonia, so he's sort of on secondment to do a specific job as a kind of governor's deputy, in an area where there aren't many conventional legionary troops.

Possibly this would really be a civilian job, but because I am trying to reconcile Eagle of the Ninth with history, I need it to be an auxiliary one, and there does seem to be some evidence to support centurions being assigned to do that sort of thing.

Date: 2013-04-21 01:12 pm (UTC)
ext_189645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] bunn.livejournal.com
... my main problem is almost a problem of expression - how would a lowly member of the troops refer to him in a way thta makes it clear he's in charge? Maybe I should give him a nickname or something. :-/

Date: 2013-04-21 05:15 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firin.livejournal.com
A nickname would work, clearly one of which he approves, together with an attitude that indicates respect.

Date: 2013-04-21 05:15 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firin.livejournal.com
To be honest, that doesn't sound like the kind of job that a Centurion would do, but a Legate of some description, subordinate to the Governor. It may help to find the extant references to centurions doing this kind of thing, if you recall that there were examples. I can't remember any off the top of my head, but I've forgotten more over the years than I think I initially learned, so that in itself means nothing!

Date: 2013-04-21 07:12 pm (UTC)
ext_189645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] bunn.livejournal.com
Hmm. Even if I'm right that this might be a centurion job rather than a Legate / Tribune one, it is the kind of thing that is liable to pull the reader up as a 'hang on, is that really right???' sort of thing. I'm inclined to think avoid naming the rank and just show him as Doing Important Things might be safest...

Date: 2013-04-21 09:29 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firin.livejournal.com
Absolutely no reason why that wouldn't work. :)

Date: 2013-04-21 09:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firin.livejournal.com
Especially if he has special, verging on unique skills and/or insight to add to the silver trade issue. That makes him an exception, so if anyone does think about it enough to query, it's okay.

Date: 2013-04-21 09:59 pm (UTC)
ext_189645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] bunn.livejournal.com
Good point!

Date: 2013-04-21 10:03 pm (UTC)
ext_189645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] bunn.livejournal.com
... I don't know if my research skills are letting me down, but I'm really lacking in detail on job roles in the second century. I tried rummaging about Tribunes previously, and now about centurions, and although there's more on centurions than tribunes, it mostly seems to be Earlier, Much Later, or at best Far Away. So I'm thinking exceptions should definitely be allowed. Even if grand-daddy Centurion did it THIS way in Egypt, surely that is no reason for his grandson in Britain to have to behave just the same!

Date: 2013-04-22 10:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firin.livejournal.com
If Ms Davis can get away with transcribing modern forensic and detection techniques into the Rome of Vespasian, I'm pretty sure you can get away with a well reasoned exception to the textbook norm!

Date: 2013-04-22 08:46 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] king-pellinor.livejournal.com
From my limited knowledge of the subject, I think that as you say "Centurion" covers what would nowadays be junior or field rank. If there was any sort of rating system outside the legions we don't seem to know what it was; the fact that there was one inside the legion might suggest that there wasn't another one that could be adopted to cover legionary centurions.

So one might conclude that Romans would be used to the idea that a Centurion could be anything from a fresh-faced graduate to an experienced commander or a hardbitten former sergeant-major, and so would be used to adapting how they react to them in different situations. Not that this helps, of course.

The other approach would be to give him a post which is distinct from his rank (in the way that Lt Colonel is a rank and Battalion Commander is a post). The Romans seemed to like calling people things like Extraordinarii, or Tribune of this or that. Quaesitor Extraordinarius Gubernatorii, perhaps? Or a grammatically and semantically correct equivalent, anyway :-) (apologies to people who know Latin).

Date: 2013-04-22 10:17 am (UTC)
ext_189645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] bunn.livejournal.com
Ooh, that's a good idea. I will look into post-names.

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